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effika
Black Belt
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
Posts: 882
Location: the Midwest, USA
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 Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2003 12:41 am Post subject: |
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| You're one of the few guys I've heard say that, Valour. Kudos! |
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whiteboy
Anti-Static Strap
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 437
Location: Lehigh Acres, Fl
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| Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2003 2:46 am Post subject: |
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I would also have to agree w/ Valaur. Personally I think that a woman that has to work in a place like that is just degrading herself and is then not worth my time (beside my ex-girlfriend/best friend would kill me even if I just passed thru in the parking lot). And a guy that visits those places are just as bad. But that is my opinion on that matter. As toward the main question, I'm a guy that works in roughly a 2 to 1.5 ratio of FEMALE/MALE
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SeMag
Black Belt
Joined: 09 Dec 2002
Posts: 538
Location: Tijuana BC, Mexico
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| Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2003 12:45 am Post subject: |
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I must agree with Valour about the Lesbians, I have seen some real lesbians and I really dont understand the desire to be near them.
About the girls taking their clothes off, also agree, but only if they do it for money, thats degrading, If on the other hand, they do it because they really like you, one on one, I must say I like it, a lot.
SeMag
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Welcome to Tijuana
Con el Coyote no hay Aduana...
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Johnny Mnemonic
Black Belt 1st Degree
Joined: 31 Oct 2001
Posts: 1903
Location: McKinney, Tx
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| Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2003 10:53 am Post subject: |
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I don't think you can really classify any lesbian or stripper as a group. To say they are sleezy, or just a lady with a crew cut and flannels. Maybe Jerry Springer is a good example of the worst, but once you judge others you yourself are judged (and I'm not religious, heh).
I have seen plenty of lesbians, even dated some that were quite wonderful human beings. I have also been to strip clubs ranging everywhere from the cheap and slutty to the more respectable places. While the whole ideal in general is basically legal prostitution, any man who says they would not enjoy watching girls dance and strip has issues.
Lots of things are degrading. Stripping for money, begging for a date, washing car windows for money, but I won't put myself on a morale high ground to say that I've never been to a strip club, or I find that behavior degrading. Sure it isn't where I want my girlfriend or daughters to work, but if you have never had a boy's night out in your youth, you're just missing out.
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Valour
Black Belt 2nd Degree
Joined: 05 Oct 2002
Posts: 2893
Location: Rochester, NY USA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2003 11:44 am Post subject: |
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| Johnny Mnemonic wrote: | I don't think you can really classify any lesbian or stripper as a group. To say they are sleezy, or just a lady with a crew cut and flannels. Maybe Jerry Springer is a good example of the worst, but once you judge others you yourself are judged (and I'm not religious, heh).
I have seen plenty of lesbians, even dated some that were quite wonderful human beings. I have also been to strip clubs ranging everywhere from the cheap and slutty to the more respectable places. While the whole ideal in general is basically legal prostitution, any man who says they would not enjoy watching girls dance and strip has issues.
Lots of things are degrading. Stripping for money, begging for a date, washing car windows for money, but I won't put myself on a morale high ground to say that I've never been to a strip club, or I find that behavior degrading. Sure it isn't where I want my girlfriend or daughters to work, but if you have never had a boy's night out in your youth, you're just missing out. |
Those of us who aren't repressed don't find the "boys night out" experience all that appealing. If you're in touch with your wild side, there is no need to hide it for as long as possible and then let it out for a night of frat boy behavior.
I don't/wouldn't like to watch a stripper strip because it's her "job." All degradation aside, it just doesn't do anything for me to know that they aren't stripping for me -- they're stripping for my money. It's too impersonal and capitalistic. Now if I girl I knew and liked wanted to strip for me, that's a whole different deal...
-Jem
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Johnny Mnemonic
Black Belt 1st Degree
Joined: 31 Oct 2001
Posts: 1903
Location: McKinney, Tx
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| Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2003 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Valour wrote: | | Those of us who aren't repressed don't find the "boys night out" experience all that appealing. If you're in touch with your wild side, there is no need to hide it for as long as possible and then let it out for a night of frat boy behavior. |
That is an extreme rationalization. There is no build up of honey do chores and watching TLC with your female counterparts until you have a need for sports watching, cigar smoking, poker playing night out with the guys. It's not a need of male bonding frat party; it's just fun. What's the harm of a group of single males going to a club for some fun? Only if a signifigant other is not comfortable or supportive of the idea, there are no victims. Yes the dancers are pretty much after your money, but you can just go and watch for free (if you don't count 5-dollar beers). In life, it's just another activity that you can enjoy or not participate in. For me, I think how could it not be entertaining, unless you go into a real cheap dive. Nor am I saying it's something that should be done often. For me it's been a 4-5 time event in my 25 years of life, and I had fun while I was there.
My point is everyone can say they don't like it because the strippers are just working for the money. I just don't think the actual issue is being addressed, why is looking at a very willing and desireable female so taboo? It's just like looking at a playboy magazine, which I find hard for any male to turn down. You think those models pose for the sake of art?
Or maybe everyone just wants to show they have high morals in a topic dedicated to any female members here.
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Valour
Black Belt 2nd Degree
Joined: 05 Oct 2002
Posts: 2893
Location: Rochester, NY USA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2003 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Johnny Mnemonic wrote: |
My point is everyone can say they don't like it because the strippers are just working for the money. I just don't think the actual issue is being addressed, why is looking at a very willing and desireable female so taboo? It's just like looking at a playboy magazine, which I find hard for any male to turn down. You think those models pose for the sake of art?
Or maybe everyone just wants to show they have high morals in a topic dedicated to any female members here. |
To me there is something sad and pathetic about a stripper, and I just can't get turned on by someone that I think is pathetic. Under different (voluntary) circumstances I think stripping is great. A stipper is not "willing" to do anything but dance, take her clothes off, and take your money. The "willing woman" part is all in your imagination.
Playboy magazine features successful, educated women who also happen to be nude. Strippers are poor women who need the money -- Playboy playmates are usually in Ivy League colleges, are exploring modelling careers, etc. Sure they're doing it for the money, but the situation is totally different because of the circumstances, the environment, the audience, and the amount of money involved. A playmate will pose for one photo shoot and make $100,000 and probably never do it again. A stripper dances all night and makes at most a few hundred dollars. One is exhibition the other is live entertainment. Posing nude in a safe, controlled environment and dancing nude in a club are not the same thing.
I have nothing that I need to prove to any female members of this group via discussion of this nature. I've been single for a long time, by choice, and if I needed a girlfriend I wouldn't be looking for one here. I'm a model -- I don't need to beg for female attention on the Internet, much less on a forum for computers; if I want female attention I'll go out to a dance club. My morals are as they are, but I haven't brought that up at all and I don't know why you think this is a moral issue. It's not a moral issue at all -- it's a taste issue.
-Jem
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"The proverb says that Providence protects children and idiots. This is really true. I know because I have tested it." -Mark Twain
I wrote this book: www.herotale.com
And here's the next one: www.emeraldblackbird.com |
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SeMag
Black Belt
Joined: 09 Dec 2002
Posts: 538
Location: Tijuana BC, Mexico
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2003 12:34 am Post subject: |
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All this is Eddie Izzard's fault
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Welcome to Tijuana..
Tequila, Sexo y Mariguana..
Welcome to Tijuana
Con el Coyote no hay Aduana...
Manu Chau.
Songs to be proud of...... |
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Wookie8662
Black Belt 2nd Degree
Joined: 28 Dec 2001
Posts: 2842
Location: Downey, CA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:59 am Post subject: |
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Been following this since it started.
Just wanted to say that this has been an interesting thread so far.
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Aussie
Mobo-fu Master
Joined: 22 Nov 1999
Posts: 10244
Location: Mackay, Queensland, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2003 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Been following this since it started.
Just wanted to say that this has been an interesting thread so far. |
Yeah, interesting like Days of Our Lives:-
effika goes off for a couple of months and johnny forgets her.
GillianTan wants to know if johnny plays on her servers but johnny says that he doesn't get a decent ping there.
gaviota thinks that there are a lot more women working on it than you think.
Hardware Junkie started out with 12 girls but by the end of the year he only had 3 left and he finds that significant.
SeMag is a male lesbian with a problem.
effika dislikes guys with lesbian tendencies.
MoboCop says that a survey has shown that 96% of males have members.
EvLwMn is a COM who says that men think LUG's are meat markets.
Glenn Schaeffer says that women are the reason he doesn't feel all alone.
effika has a disproportionate number of male friends who wish all women were lesbians.
webster thinks that geeks get all excited when they meet girlies.
VeggieBurger thinks he's a bloke but is not quite sure.
Valour thinks that women who take their clothes off for money are sleazy unless there are well educated and get lots of money for it then it's OK.
Johnny Mnemonic dates lesbians and finds them to be wonderful human beings.
Johnny Mnemonic confesses to going to strip clubs but only to make sure that his girlfriend or daughters aren't working there.
Valour asserts that he's not repressed and is in touch with his wild side.
Valour is a model that doesn't need to beg for female attention.
SeMag is convinced that it's all Eddie Izzard's fault.
Do you reckon the script writers could do anything with that lot? 
Aussie
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