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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 3:03 pm 
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http://cnn.org/2005/TECH/internet/02/22 ... index.html

IMO, I have to side with MS on this one. Who cares if it cuts into Symantecs/Mcaffees part of the market. You dont hear them complaining about AVG (free) and personally, I think its (AVG) is better then both of them.

If MS wants to integrate security into their OS, what better people could do it? They wrote/designed the code, who better would know how to protect it.. at least thats how I see it. We all know that Windows isnt known for their uber security, but I dont see this as a problem. Especially if they can keep their applications slimmed down or integrated where it doesnt hog a ton of resources like Norton did on my computer.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 1:03 am 
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This is a huge deal.

MS has a history of stealing a market share for inferior products just because they get installed with the OS or an option..

What does Mcafee and Symantec have to lose or gain by this? They sell so many products because the are included in so many setups from proprietary to new mobos for a free trial, back in the day they used to have many proprietary systems that allowed them to use new defs with a tired and old engine..

So all this does is trade the competition over a new realm..
I think not, MS will steal sales from both from their name alone, if MS starts bundling trial versions etc..

Ive heard really good things about the new mcafee setup too, much better than symantecs from all reports Ive seen.

Without Mcafee and Norton getting their users from the free trial they do have followers to fall back on from past usage and experience no matter how bad each was at any individual time.

Wish MS would put more resources into fixing its own problems (the 78 secunia advisors for IE alone!!!) and plug the holes instead of trying to just use an outside resource.
Most DoS attacks prior to the blaster had no attention, once the blaster worm attacked MS, all of a sudden there was media attention and a fix from MS... For shame
There is a huge list of issues with XP and everyone knows about them but they just wont fix it or cant.. Just fix the holes instead of BS like a crappy firewall and DeP...


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 8:53 am 
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Quote:
"We believe they'd be better off in focusing on making sure that their platform, the Windows operating system, is less subject to attack," Schwarz said.


as K says too, this is the real issue. There are no known viruses for Mac OSX; and it's not because there are fewer Mac OSXs. (That would be a reason why there might be fewer viruses not zero viruses.)

M$'s quandry is that if it keeps 'free' bundling stuff it'll come up against monopoly (anti-trust) legislation. A month or so ago European legislation forced M$ to offer XP without Media Player. (But they are under no obligation to reduce the price for that; so they're not likely to get any orders for it....)

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 6:20 pm 
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If I may, when I first started computing in earnest (Internet and gaming, along with productivity applications), I was bugged that Windows didn't have the utilities I thought should have been included, such as optimizing tools, and so forth. My rationale was that such things should have been part of the deal; I really hate a la carte pricing. I felt like I was getting gouged for functionality that is what I perceived to be fundamental to a quality product.

But now that these "niche" markets are created and entrenched, and now that I have used many of these third party tools with success, I have my doubts as to how well MS may implement these products. And even though I still feel like I'm being taken for a ride, I recognize that it takes market pressure sometimes to produce excellence. Just my $0.02.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:37 am 
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Quote:
I have my doubts as to how well MS may implement these products.


well if you take M$ new firewall as an example; compared to commercial products; it's rubbish. But their argument is that they've made a minimum requirement product, trying to walk the path between not leaving their customers exposed to critical threats but not putting ZoneAlarm et al out of business.

That's BS of course because people think they're safe behind a crap firewall.........and they're not. If they're going to do it, they should do it well or not at all.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:13 am 
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I think he was just stating what we all know... MS needs to stop getting in the preventive posture as they have been as of late and start fixing the holes.
I have put DeP down pretty hard, many think this has fixed the activeX issue in IE, it may well have but there are many workarounds this, as well as digital signatures which may leave a user to think they are safe and isnt the case.

For stability issues I will give you an example, IE6 allows a great amount of errors in html code and still produces a web page in an invalid html or css code. Why? I dont know. Ie's structure is so lax but can fix website errors, is this a good thing?
Ms sets its own rules and doesnt follow protocol, this needs to change.
There are standards set by many on how web pages should be validated, wc3 etc...
MS will be on top for a long time, but a not for profit web browser like FF has me and millions hooked.

Any small company or open source project can create a product much better than anything you have to pay for or from MS..
For an example this forum code was created in PHP. An open source c++ code same as Firefox...

PHP is an excellent setup, once the new revision is done it will be the best code available for any forum and still a free product used and created by users... It follows standards, MS does not.


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