Gun Control

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Gun Control

Postby c327 » Sat Jan 10, 2015 8:13 am

Well watching and listening to the current killing events in Paris France just goes to show folks that gun control only works for the honest law abiding citizen who normally don't do any crime. As far as the bad folks go who seem to want to kill every one that does not conform to their warped beliefs getting automatic weapons and worse is no problem and some of the most strongest gun laws don't apply to them.

If there were ever a time for an honest law abiding person to legally own and carry a firearm it's now, which I do and so does the wife because today you never know when or where you may be faced with having to protect your own life.
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Re: Gun Control

Postby Karlsweldt » Sat Jan 10, 2015 9:50 am

Indeed, the recent deadly sprees in Europe are disturbing. Demented radicals and their warped beliefs, or whatever they call themselves. Then too the people who are unsound of mind.
We don't need "new" gun control laws.. just increase penalties for illegal gun use or possession. And have one universal Federal rule about owning any kind of firearm. Local governments have the right to impose stiffer rules about firearm possession, carrying and use. Any one wanting a firearm should have to attend a 30-day training course, administered by law enforcement or military pros. And during that time, a 100% background and mentality check should be done.
As to military grade weapons, they should not be in the hands of anyone except the military or elite law enforcement personnel.
Gun shows should be able to sell their items, but only to certified buyers.. the result of having passed the safety and handling courses noted. A Federal ID similar to the SS # would suffice for quick and accurate checks.
But for the criminal element, the 'black market' is rife with all kinds of firearms and "no questions asked". That has to be eliminated.
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Re: Gun Control

Postby c327 » Sat Jan 10, 2015 5:19 pm

Karlsweldt wrote:Indeed, the recent deadly sprees in Europe are disturbing. Demented radicals and their warped beliefs, or whatever they call themselves. Then too the people who are unsound of mind.
We don't need "new" gun control laws.. just increase penalties for illegal gun use or possession. And have one universal Federal rule about owning any kind of firearm. Local governments have the right to impose stiffer rules about firearm possession, carrying and use. Any one wanting a firearm should have to attend a 30-day training course, administered by law enforcement or military pros. And during that time, a 100% background and mentality check should be done.
As to military grade weapons, they should not be in the hands of anyone except the military or elite law enforcement personnel.
Gun shows should be able to sell their items, but only to certified buyers.. the result of having passed the safety and handling courses noted. A Federal ID similar to the SS # would suffice for quick and accurate checks.
But for the criminal element, the 'black market' is rife with all kinds of firearms and "no questions asked". That has to be eliminated.


The Federal Government does have a law that covers firearms, it's called the Second Ammendment to the Constitution of the United States. All the laws that the crooked politicians can dream up and enact will have zero affect on the criminal element and all it will accomplish is to hamper a law abiding citizen from protecting him or herself from serious bodily harm.

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Re: Gun Control

Postby evasive » Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:52 am

<RANT>
I can tell you if we had your gun law in this area, there would be a lot less people living in here as we are not one country to start with. Every day we would have border incidents and people shot over basically nothing. Most of the time we have a war going on in here, I cannot imagine what would happen if weapons were "unhampered" available to any "law-abiding" citizen. Recently all the shooting clubs in here needed to review their procedures and protocols. Research showed that unregistered members could walk in and obtain live ammunition without this being noticed. This research was done after a young man from one of the clubs took his weapon home (he was allowed to do so) and next day went to a shopping mall and just started shooting. result: 20 people killed. His club was shut down btw.
In here that is shocking news, in the USA I might think you got used to news like that, as it seem to happen several times per year. At least, based on the cases that make the news.
<RANT OFF>

Seriously, what happened in Paris has got nothing to do with normal people or even religion for that matter. There were two people that lost their mind, focused on getting a weapon in whatever way possible and killing people.
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Re: Gun Control

Postby Roach412 » Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:35 am

what's the real difference between the guys that "lost their minds" and the guy that happened to use an easily exploited access issue? nothing really. if that guy wanted ammunition, he could have gotten it a million different ways, legal or otherwise. he already had a weapon (legal or not), but again...very easy to get if somebody wants it.

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Re: Gun Control

Postby bdub » Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:32 am

http://www.attn.com/stories/663/liam-ne ... tories-663

“There’s too many @#$! guns out there,” the actor told gulfnews.com.

Neeson then steered the conversation toward the US.

“Especially in America," Neeson continued. "I think the population is like, 320 million? There’s over 300 million guns. Privately owned, in America. I think it’s a @#$! disgrace. Every week now we’re picking up a newspaper and seeing, ‘Yet another few kids have been killed in schools.’”

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Re: Gun Control

Postby bdub » Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:55 pm

http://www.citylab.com/politics/2013/01 ... ign=buffer

If it were a country, New Orleans (with a rate 62.1 gun murders per 100,000 people) would rank second in the world.
• Detroit's gun homicide rate (35.9) is just a bit less than El Salvador (39.9).
• Baltimore's rate (29.7) is not too far off that of Guatemala (34.8).
• Gun murder in Newark (25.4) and Miami (23.7) is comparable to Colombia (27.1).
• Washington D.C. (19) has a higher rate of gun homicide than Brazil (18.1).
• Atlanta's rate (17.2) is about the same as South Africa (17).
• Cleveland (17.4) has a higher rate than the Dominican Republic (16.3).
• Gun murder in Buffalo (16.5) is similar to Panama (16.2).
• Houston's rate (12.9) is slightly higher than Ecuador's (12.7).
• Gun homicide in Chicago (11.6) is similar to Guyana (11.5).
• Phoenix's rate (10.6) is slightly higher than Mexico (10).
• Los Angeles (9.2) is comparable to the Philippines (8.9).
• Boston rate (6.2) is higher than Nicaragua (5.9).
• New York, where gun murders have declined to just four per 100,000, is still higher than Argentina (3).
• Even the cities with the lowest homicide rates by American standards, like San Jose and Austin, compare to Albania and Cambodia respectively.
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Re: Gun Control

Postby Roach412 » Thu Jan 15, 2015 2:47 pm

and yet...when you actually take the locations where there's the highest LEGAL gun ownership, those numbers plummet.

look. i live in one of the most segregated metro areas in the US, and i see shootings on the news almost every single day... why only on the news and not in my back yard? because i don't live anywhere near the 2 or 3 miles of area where 95% of the shootings occur. you remove those, and it's one of the safest metros in the US. a tiny, tiny fraction of the minority of population is creating massive numbers - especially in those cities. in statistics, we call these data points outliers. they do not apply to the general population.

gang violence accounts for a staggering amount of these numbers. guess how many of those guns are legal or licensed...or if the carriers of them really give a fip about it(or laws in general)? whether the US has 600 million or 60 million guns is moot. the availability is a false flag...as weapons are "not available" in many of the locations/states/cities where there's shootings.

i was just at a gun show this weekend where a guy, selling his personal collection items, had over 100 firearms at his booth. my father-in-law has probably just as many - it's his passion, and actually is part of his estate planning. guns don't depreciate in value - so his collection is worth a lot of money. i've met dozens of people over the last few years who have massive collections - so the "per capita" shock-factor is out-of-line with reality and is really only shocking to those who don't understand the details(and culture) surrounding the millions of responsible, and legal, gun owners.

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Re: Gun Control

Postby bdub » Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:11 pm

there's millions of responsible refrigerator owners... but it took only a few deaths by people who got trapped in them for laws to be made changing the way refrigerators close, and where you could get rid of them. no one vilified government when they fixed this problem. no one said the government is trying to take your refrigerators away!

and there's MANY MANY MANY more deaths by firearms. not just by criminals, but by plenty of "law abiding" citizens too. the rate of suicides in homes goes up a lot when you have a gun in the house.... etc etc, I could go on with the arguments, we all know them. but it's truth that in many countries where guns are limited, there's almost no gun deaths. citizens feel safer in those countries... and like liam neeson, they think the US is a disgrace, and I'm sure some would say a laughingstock.
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Re: Gun Control

Postby Roach412 » Fri Jan 16, 2015 1:01 pm

seriously, it's not the proliferation of guns. it's culture. it's mindsets. it's an unnumerable amount of external factors which lead to these statistics. just because guns are more restricted in other countries does not beget a causality. most of those countries have restrictive gun laws simply because the populace fears weapons, or has a historical predisposition against them...their base culture is completely different. i would put down huge sums of money to bet that if you repealed those restrictive laws in those countries and opened up gun sales that there would be hardly a blip in gun crime.

does having a glut of weapons make the black market for illegal ones cheaper though? perhaps - in-fact probably yes. does that REALLY matter? is it going to REALLY make a difference when somebody wants a gun? i know for a fact i can get my hands on a full-auto ak47, military caliber - for less than $3k. those are not american weapons...they are imported from over seas, and have no (aboslutely none) bearing on the availability, cost or manufacturing of firearms within the US.

so a basic (used) handgun is roughly $500 on the street now, and so maybe if it's twice as hard to get them it'll be what? $1,500 or $1,000...? they're going to have to rob a few more stores/people, sell more product, fence more, etc. before they can afford it...do they care? no. they'll just do it. they'll find some other way to get it, and they don't care about our stupid laws anyway.

until we can fix the drug and gang obsession in the US nothing any laws do will make a bit of difference - except make me either wait long or pay more for what law-abiding citizens have every right to purchase/own/carry/etc. there's very little point(IMHO) in pressing the issue, there's a lot more problems requiring people's attention, money and time.

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