The Big One....................

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The Big One....................

Postby CivilDissent » Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:41 pm

Well, looks like the big one is not going to be during George Bushs' presidency...........the way the market is going today.

Obama is going to be known for the big dip.

Oh, they will still try to blame Bush for it but Obama had his chance and he sure made a big deal about that when he was campaigning for the presidency. :wink:

Turns out, it was not all he thought it was.
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Postby bdub » Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:52 am

if the dji goes down to 6000, you may be right...
your assumptions are a little early. also to, realize that the tea party started this recession because of the proposed contraction of government means there will be not as much money out there to fuel a lot of things that had fuel before.
markets are adjusting accordingly, and with no stimulus a recession was obvious.
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Postby CivilDissent » Thu Aug 11, 2011 9:11 am

Ok, maybe you are correct but it is not over yet.

Also, last time, the situation was mostly in the US whereas now it is all over the world meaning that we cannot just suck off of Europe and such. I would guess that even China is getting tired of us.

Actually, if the government stops trying to strangle business with all their laws and rules, business would be more willing to expand, hire more people and therefore enlarge the economy instead of picking up and moving somewhere else like Mexico or Asia like so many have done already.

That is what happens whether Obama likes it or not. The president cannot force a company to stay in the states and when they move, jobs are lost (in the US), our economy shrinks and other countries grow.

Whether we like it or not, when the hotshots get what they like they tend to stay and that is a good thing for us, the small people. We do not like it but it is a fact.
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Postby bdub » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:16 am

CivilDissent wrote:Actually, if the government stops trying to strangle business with all their laws and rules, business would be more willing to expand, hire more people and therefore enlarge the economy...


can you name any of these regulations that are "strangling" business?
taxes have been at their lowest rate since the 50's, where is all the job growth that was supposed to spur?

hypocrite alert... the tea party freshman who was elected "president" of the congressional freshman class introduced his first bill recently... it makes it easier for businesses to hire h-2a guestworkers in lieu of genuine american workers.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... ml?hpid=z2


most of this "small government" movement is just a shill for people like the koch brothers, who want government regulations out of their way, so they can pollute as much as they want, and generally be the kings of the proverbial court. most tea-partiers are being played like accordians.
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Postby bdub » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:49 am

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/12/opini ... c_ev=click

"So how did Washington discourse come to be dominated by the wrong issue?

Hard-line Republicans have, of course, played a role. Although they don’t seem to truly care about deficits — try suggesting any rise in taxes on the rich — they have found harping on deficits a useful way to attack government programs."

"What would a real response to our problems involve? First of all, it would involve more, not less, government spending for the time being — with mass unemployment and incredibly low borrowing costs, we should be rebuilding our schools, our roads, our water systems and more. It would involve aggressive moves to reduce household debt via mortgage forgiveness and refinancing. And it would involve an all-out effort by the Federal Reserve to get the economy moving, with the deliberate goal of generating higher inflation to help alleviate debt problems.

The usual suspects will, of course, denounce such ideas as irresponsible. But you know what’s really irresponsible? Hijacking the debate over a crisis to push for the same things you were advocating before the crisis, and letting the economy continue to bleed. "
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Postby Roach412 » Fri Aug 12, 2011 9:48 am

you conveniently left out the part of the article pointing out that obama picked this fight, and shouldn't have. he single-handedly provided the right with this ammunition.

For more than a year and a half — ever since President Obama chose to make deficits, not jobs, the central focus of the 2010 State of the Union address — we’ve had a public conversation that has been dominated by budget concerns, while almost ignoring unemployment.


is it right that this is what people are focused on? no, not really. but here we are.

however, entitlement reform is needed, on many fronts - if somebody can't accept that simple statement then they're lost. plain and simple. it's broken. you can't run any program at a loss and expect it to succeed. and you sure as hell can't operate it at a loss, and then continue to pull money out of it for completely unrelated things. mismanagement, poor oversight, crooked thieves, whatever you want to drum up, they're all correct. it all has so many problems that i don't even know where to begin. if gutting the funding for it is what's needed to simplify and streamline it's processes and governance, then you know what? do it. ether we pay now or we pay again, and way more, in the future...and again...and again.

obama needs to take the lead on something, throwing speeches out there - while flashy and sound-bite-filled, are just empty in action. he can spew all he wants, but nothing he does (or lack of what he does) is helping anything. he was handed practically this entire government when he came to office to do almost what he pleased, and has done what? made is so my health care costs 3 times as much? great. thanks.

all i hear out of washington is bickering, no actual actionable ideas constant babble of "they're not compromising", from both sides of our retarded 2-party-system. at this point i'd rather elect an 18 year old high-school dropout to govern.

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Postby bdub » Tue Aug 16, 2011 7:23 am

Roach412 wrote:you conveniently left out the part of the article pointing out that obama picked this fight, and shouldn't have. he single-handedly provided the right with this ammunition.

For more than a year and a half — ever since President Obama chose to make deficits, not jobs, the central focus of the 2010 State of the Union address — we’ve had a public conversation that has been dominated by budget concerns, while almost ignoring unemployment.
-Roach


job creation is, of course, a concern, and the conservatives are continuously trying to keep people from getting jobs...

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/08/15 ... eaning-to/

...so they can claim that obama doesn't care about jobs, or that HE was the one to blame for the debt ceiling debate... which was a totally made up crisis to keep the administration off balance. that has been the republican playbook since mitch mconnell said that his biggest objective is to make obama a one term president.

and as far as that one sentence you picked... all it says is obama made defecit reduction a focus of one speech... it doesn't really say anything about actual policy.
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Postby Roach412 » Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:45 am

personally (and maybe i'm completely off-base here) when the president includes a specific topic in the state of the union, it's part of policy.

it's one of the most analyzed, and scrutinized, communications that comes from the white house. putting frivolous fluff into it makes no sense. they KNOW that the contents of the address are used as political ammunition for months...years even.

i'm really just saying, if he had decided to not talk about deficit reduction, and spoke to the job issue he wouldn't have put himself and the democratic party into a corner. they're laying in the bed that obama prepared - almost entirely from this address. that's why it's important in terms of "just one speech" vs. "policy". when it's the state of the union, it's not "just one speech".

it's just sad that a few republicans can shake obama and the democratic party to its core. you're right about the tactics and goals of the republican party - it's just amazing how effective they're being. that or the democrats and obama are so ineffective at either countering, or pre-emptively handling what the conservatives are doing.

i still say, obama needs to lead. not just speak. by my previous comment his speaking has dug his party and his policy into a hole. he really needs to followthrough on some of these promises that were given, and the "ideas for change" he spoke of way back when.

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Postby CivilDissent » Thu Aug 18, 2011 12:58 am

Obamas tough guy claim that everything Bush did was bad and that he, Obama, was going to change everything, to his liking, is a big part of what has bit him in the toosh.

Obama is a big part of what has separated this country so far apart.

If anyone wants to start bringing the USA back together, especially Obama, he needs to stop making big claims and try working together, for once. He needs to stop pandering to the radical left and maybe he will start getting support from more people.

Examples for bdub:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/06/ ... 5761.shtml

http://www.robertsreportonline.com/news ... ral-groups

http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=223609

And George Soros, no less.

Actions speak louder than words.

The Tea Party is heading down the drain pretty quickly, as the media will not let anyone forget, but Obama is not far behind them.

Obama made some pretty radical claims when he was running for office and guess what....it is biting him in the you know what now.
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Postby bdub » Fri Aug 19, 2011 8:16 am

your li9nks say nothing towards "govt strangling business"... at least that's what i thought i asked for.
here's a link that actually has some good information, and is current. i don't believe this guy is liberal slant... just plain facts, wrapped with a little conjecture, but moderate in nature.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/ ... story.html

you must remember, too, that obama may have made a lot of claims about what he was going to do and etc, that you think he is balking on... but he is extremely hand-tied by the state of the economy. most of the promises and claims he made were while bush and chaney were saying "everything is alright, the economy is fine, don't worry". then in late 2008, just before the election, everything goes to hell... would you have been able to handle3 the pressure like obama is handling it????
obama will be elected again... you will see.
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