It is getting better day by day....

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It is getting better day by day....

Postby CivilDissent » Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:57 pm

An Increasingly Tough Sell

AFP – US President Barack Obama (C) greets a crowd at MacDill Air Force Base, Florida. Obama took his barnstorming … Before his stimulus plan passed the Senate in a 61-37 vote, President Obama's approval ratings far outweighed those of his $838 billion bill. Which is why, in the last 48 hours, he traveled to hard-hit Elkhart, Indiana, to host his first town hall since becoming president, returned to D.C. to host his first news conference, then flew to Florida to promote his plan alongside Republican Gov. Charlie Crist. A push for bipartisanship (the bill garnered only three GOP votes from all of Congress)? A PR spree for America? More likely, both. As the House and Senate dig in for what will likely be tough negotiations on a final package, Obama is working hard to save the stimulus in the court of public opinion.

A recent poll by Pew Research Center found that a narrow majority of Americans, just 51%, support the stimulus. And that's down from 57% in January. Even worse for the administration, support seems to be dropping among people who say they've learned more about the stimulus:


Notably, support for the proposal is now much lower than it was in January among those who have heard a lot about the economic stimulus. By 49% to 41%, those who have heard a lot about the proposal now see it as a good idea; in January, those who had heard a lot favored it by more than two-to-one.

Furthermore, a poll from Rasmussen reports that 62% of voters want more tax cuts and less government spending in the plan. This must be music to the ears of Republicans, who have been on a media blitz of their own, arguing for the same. Newly elected chairman of the Republican National Committee Michael Steele wasted no time in explaining why he thinks his party should vote no.


"The fastest way to help those families is by letting them keep more of the money they earn. Individual empowerment: that's how you stimulate the economy."

On "Face the Nation," Sen. John McCain took a few whacks at his former opponent's stimulus bill, calling it everything from "a setback to change" to "not bipartisan" to "generational theft" to "fundamentally bad for America."

It's not just lawmakers who are working to change the package. Conservative public policy group Americans for Prosperity has become a huge Search spike on Yahoo! after circulating an online petition and sending an open letter to the U.S. Senate urging "no" votes on the stimulus.

While on the campaign trail, Obama's speeches were often crucial in turning a negative story his way. With public opinion waning, his recent treks to hard-hit American towns may be just the stimulus his stimulus plan needs.



http://pewresearch.org/pubs/1109/poll-s ... ry-popular

Notice that tax cuts are deemed as much more effective than spending everyone's hard earned money.

Note the marks on 'Opposition Among Those Who Have Heard The Most'.
"A mouth does not have to be open for words to be said or be spoken."

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Postby thomas_w_bowman » Wed Feb 11, 2009 11:01 am

Heck most Senators and Congressmen don't fully understand what is in the 'stimulus' bills.
Lifetime limits on Medicare (sorry, you limit is reached, now you have no Medical Insurance - "You've had a Full life" - no more medical for you)
Verification that Contractors used are Citizens was removed, so we now can hire perhaps 300,000 illegals to rennovate roads.
Note that when GM got it's first bucket of bailout $ (over $1 Billion), they promptly invested it in Brazil.
Perhaps we should also grant 'temporary specail power' to the President to avoid any delays on stuff we need Now Now Now (Star Wars II, Speaker -> Emperor Palpatine)...
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Postby CivilDissent » Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:47 pm

White House dampens stimulus expectations

WASHINGTON (Reuters)- President Barack Obama's aides warned Americans on Sunday not to expect instant miracles from the $787 billion economic stimulus bill he will sign this week, but said it would help eventually.

Obama is due to sign the bill passed last week by Congress in Denver on Tuesday. It was the first major legislative victory of his young presidency, which could rise or fall with its success or failure.

"There will be signs of activity very quickly," David Axelrod, the White House senior adviser, said on "Fox News Sunday." "But it's going to take time for that to show up in the statistics. The president has said it's likely to get worse before it gets better."

White House spokesman Robert Gibbs used similar language on CBS' "Face the Nation."

"I don't think there's any doubt that we've seen this economy has gotten worse just in the last few months. The acceleration in job loss probably means that this economy is going to get worse before it gets better," he said.

Obama himself said last week that if he failed to heal the economy, he would be out of a job by 2012, when he faces re-election.

The White House hopes the package will save or create 3.5 million jobs. Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody's Economy.com, said on "Fox News Sunday" that was likely too optimistic.

"By my estimate, it will add 2 to 2.5 million jobs, more than would be the case without stimulus, by the end of 2010. That translates into a lower unemployment rate of about a point to a point and a half," he said.

Only three Republican senators supported the bill and no Republicans in the House of Representatives backed it. They kept up their criticism on the Sunday television talk shows.

"This bill was not bipartisan. It is incredibly expensive. It has hundreds of billions of dollars in projects which will not yield in jobs," said John McCain, whom Obama defeated in last year's presidential election, said on CNN's "State of the Union."

Gibbs said Obama's team had crafted a stimulus bill to produce jobs as quickly as possible in an economy that lost 3.6 million in the past year.

BALANCED APPROACH

"The urgency to get something done was very important," he said. "What we have here is a very balanced approach that's going to put people to work."

Obama faces a new potential flashpoint next week when two Detroit automakers, General Motors Corp and Chrysler LLC, must reach agreements with the United Auto Workers labor union to restructure themselves.

Talks between GM and the union broke down on Saturday. Chrysler's negotiations with the UAW are also deadlocked.

Axelrod made it clear the White House would not intervene in the situation until after Tuesday.

"Obviously, this is a difficult situation and everyone's going to have to continue to work toward a solution. We're going to wait and see what the automakers have to say on Tuesday and we'll go from there," he said.

On a third front, Obama plans to issue a plan to tackle the housing crisis next week, hoping to stem a flood of home foreclosures that has weakened the banking system and frozen credit markets while continuing to depress house prices.

(Editing by Patricia Zengerle)



http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090215/bs_ ... a_stimulus

And better and better..............

Another, significant if not completely pertinent, point was made on 2 of the 3 political shows of Sunday morning. Why, when Obama claimed that he would let the public see everything in the bill before he signed it, did he not do as he stated?
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Postby Roach412 » Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:05 pm

fact: i hate my government.

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Postby Ge FOrce 543 » Fri Mar 13, 2009 10:26 pm

Roach412 wrote:fact: i hate my government.

-Roach


fact: YOU ARE BIG JERK
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Postby Roach412 » Sat Mar 14, 2009 12:20 am

Ge FOrce 543 wrote:
Roach412 wrote:fact: i hate my government.

-Roach


fact: YOU ARE BIG JERK


OOOOOooooooooOOOOOOOOOOO i'm scared of your pathetic attempts at insulting me and my beliefs. please....post something worth reading.

-Roach
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Postby evasive » Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:14 am

fact: the crisis is worldwide.
fact: a few people got away with astronomic amounts of money
fact: we all need to earn more money to replace the stolen money
fact: no matter what your government does, it's always wrong in somebody's eyes

question: can we stop nagging about all this and try and make the best out of it?
We hate rut, but we fear change.
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Postby greytrains » Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:01 pm

Roach412 wrote:fact: i hate my government.

-Roach


Can you elaborate on that some? Just what do you hate about the government? I suspect I know what your answer may be but others might not. Please give us some details on your reason for this statement.

evasive wrote:fact: the crisis is worldwide.
fact: a few people got away with astronomic amounts of money
fact: we all need to earn more money to replace the stolen money
fact: no matter what your government does, it's always wrong in somebody's eyes

question: can we stop nagging about all this and try and make the best out of it?


People will always gripe and complain about what they have very little control of. :roll:
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
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"A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have."
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Postby Roach412 » Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:45 pm

greytrains wrote:
Roach412 wrote:fact: i hate my government.

-Roach


Can you elaborate on that some? Just what do you hate about the government? I suspect I know what your answer may be but others might not. Please give us some details on your reason for this statement.



it's just a ton of things, all compounding together i guess.

i hate the ineffectual manner in which it is organized - it's out-dated.
i hate the ineffectual leaders which "lead" - they're also out-dated.
it can't decide to help only one tiny subset of the people, or every single person regardless of whether they should get it (thus no longer being "help")
it's a laboring gargantuan machine which hardly any group of people even can understand how it works....which some would argue it doesn't, so why even investigate how it doesn't work.
it preys on the good and honest people to gain for those whom are neither good, nor honest.

i've seen my local leaders broken down and defeated by the system/government while they were in it...a very close family friend of mine worked in the state government for years, did some good things - but in the end it just ended up getting washed away once he and his collegeues were eventually forced out...

the good things fail and are removed, or are altered to become nothing like they were intended to be - and thusly become bad.

it's just like a fast-pace degenerative disease...

-Roach
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Postby greytrains » Mon Mar 16, 2009 4:57 pm

Roach412 wrote:
greytrains wrote:
Roach412 wrote:fact: i hate my government.

-Roach


Can you elaborate on that some? Just what do you hate about the government? I suspect I know what your answer may be but others might not. Please give us some details on your reason for this statement.



it's just a ton of things, all compounding together i guess.

i hate the ineffectual manner in which it is organized - it's out-dated.
i hate the ineffectual leaders which "lead" - they're also out-dated.
it can't decide to help only one tiny subset of the people, or every single person regardless of whether they should get it (thus no longer being "help")
it's a laboring gargantuan machine which hardly any group of people even can understand how it works....which some would argue it doesn't, so why even investigate how it doesn't work.
it preys on the good and honest people to gain for those whom are neither good, nor honest.

i've seen my local leaders broken down and defeated by the system/government while they were in it...a very close family friend of mine worked in the state government for years, did some good things - but in the end it just ended up getting washed away once he and his collegeues were eventually forced out...

the good things fail and are removed, or are altered to become nothing like they were intended to be - and thusly become bad.

it's just like a fast-pace degenerative disease...

-Roach


In my opinion here are some of the reasons for the problems you stated.

1. - i hate the ineffectual manner in which it is organized - it's out-dated.

People over time see a problem and try and put a band-aid on the problem by creating a new branch of government rather then seeing if there is a current section of government that can handle the problem, or better yet let the private sector handle the problem.

2. - i hate the ineffectual leaders which "lead" - they're also out-dated.

Most of our elected leaders have very little experience in running a business let alone a large corporation that the government resembles. There are more lawyers in elected positions then businessmen.

3. -it can't decide to help only one tiny subset of the people, or every single person regardless of whether they should get it (thus no longer being "help")

Congressmen are going to try and help the people in their district so that they can get re-elected. Eventually they loose sight of the people they are suppose to be representing and feel what one group of people need everybody needs. Some of this is due to the poorly organized government.

4. - it's a laboring gargantuan machine which hardly any group of people even can understand how it works....which some would argue it doesn't, so why even investigate how it doesn't work.

Here again most of this problem can be blamed on a poorly organized government. On the other hand if people don't understand how something works and are not willing to learn then the government can do something in secret just by hiding it in all the chaos.

5. it preys on the good and honest people to gain for those whom are neither good, nor honest.

Some people think that the government is there to provide them with everything they need. If the government is going do this then they have to get the money from somewhere.

A lot of these problems could be fixed if people would take the government to court due to violations of the tenth amendment. That and if people would just pay attention to what the government is doing. Most people get there news from the TV or the radio. How many people do you know that actually read a news paper or go to an on line news source like the drudge Report. I am willing to bet not many.
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Benjamin Franklin (1706 - 1790)

"A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have."
Gerald Ford (1913 - 2006)
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